Reid Hoffman - Founder of LinkedIn발음듣기
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Reid Hoffman - Founder of LinkedIn
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We actually met a long time ago, back when Khan Academy was operating out of a walk-in closet.발음듣기
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The whole point of doing these things, and I think it's interesting for our team here, and for the audience at home and the people who are just users of Khan Academy, is just understand how someone becomes a Reid Hoffman.발음듣기
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And so, if we rewind back to your childhood, what were you like at eleven, twelve, thirteen years old?발음듣기
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Actually, I'm not even sure that I really knew what being and entrepreneur or venture capitalist was.발음듣기
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I'm not sure either of those items of language, I think I probably could have passed a word test on entrepreneur perhaps.발음듣기
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When I was around those ages I was actually pretty unconvinced about, I hadn't really thought about what life after school was.발음듣기
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Around the age of 9, this will date me because I doubt most of the folks here will actually know what this is, but did you ever play Dungeons and Dragons?발음듣기
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And part of what I did is there is a particular variant of this called RuneQuest which, the company that did it was a company called the Chaosium, it was in Berkeley, and I found that a friend of mine could introduce me to them.발음듣기
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And my dad ended up thinking it wasn't such a terrible idea when they started employing me to do editing of the scenario packs and other kinds of things.발음듣기
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And then, around the age of 12, maybe it was 13, 12 to 13, I started realizing that after high school, I would be responsible for myself.발음듣기
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And that's when I started focusing on what school was, what learning was, what you could do in terms of life.발음듣기
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It wasn't until I got all the way to college where I started having concrete thoughts about what I would be doing.발음듣기
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So when you had that realization, I guess early adolescence at age 12 or so, did you become a serious student at that point, or you just took school a little more seriously?발음듣기
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I got an F in French because basically the teacher was so boring and the thing was so irrelevant that I would read science fiction books through class the entire time. In English?발음듣기
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And the principle function, Fritz Bloom was a really good guy, good tutor, but his principle function was actually getting me to wake up to, "Wait a minute, I should be choiceful about what I'm doing."발음듣기
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And at the time, the only thing that could occur to me was, well most people who lead interesting lives from back then, and this is obviously not 100% true at all, but it was kind of a kid thing, go to college.발음듣기
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That would mean I need to do well in high school, which means I need to start doing well at academics now.발음듣기
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And in 8th grade I basically shifted entirely to now doing, I only did Dungeons and Dragons after I finished my studies.발음듣기
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Went to a school called the College Preparatory School, which was, for first year in high school, which was a private school on the border between Oakland and Berkeley.발음듣기
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And the way that I got my father to send me to the College Preparatory School, was I would, every week, when there was a bad story about Berkeley High, gang violence, drugs, anything else, anything, I'd clip it out and leave it for my father on the dining room table as part of a campaign to say, "No, you should send me to College Preparatory School."발음듣기
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That close interaction and discussion is the kind of thing, I learn faster, I pay more attention, it stimulates me more.발음듣기
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I think I'm a little bit more of an auditory than visual learner in kind of a similar, but I do read, but I read slowly.발음듣기
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Because I kind of want to understand each page very carefully, and some people read very fast.발음듣기
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And so, I knew I wanted to go to a school that was focused on academics, that was small classrooms, and the College Preparatory School was the closest thing that I could find to that.발음듣기
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Now then later, what happened is that I realized that I wanted to get independence, I got the independence bug early, so I applied for and got into a boarding school in Vermont called the Putney School, without either of my parents knowing.발음듣기
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Because I was like, "Well I'd like to do the small course classroom, but I'd like to do it somewhere thousands of miles away from the Bay Area."발음듣기
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Plus the Putney School had like, I did blacksmithing, and I did woodworking, and I've driven oxen through the woods, and I did all of these other things.발음듣기
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And I was all kind of a build up to "I'm going to figure out who I'm going to be once I get to college."발음듣기
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You go to college, you go to Stanford, so you must have been a good student, or and excellent student, so you did get your act together.발음듣기
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Well, actually on the Dungeons and Dragons thing, I stopped cold turkey (laughter) my first year in high school, Freshman year.발음듣기
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And so, what I did, this is the very last set of Dungeons and Dragons like game game that I played, I said, "Look, if you can stop smoking for 6 months, I will actually be a Game Master and, with the friends you select, I will run you through a adventure scenario."발음듣기
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So you told him, "If you give up your addiction "I will re-immerse myself in mine." (laughter)발음듣기
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And so I did this game called Aftermath!, which was a fantasy roleplaying variant that was after there was a nuclear holocaust, because that's what he chose, and so we did that.발음듣기
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The primary thing that I knew is that I wanted to I liked ideas, and I wanted to be involved in thinking about what it was to be a human being.발음듣기
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And when I was going to college, I knew that was interesting to me and so I came back here, actually, to Stanford for two reasons.발음듣기
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Which was then called Western Culture, I think it's now called World Civilization or something.발음듣기
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Which was kind of this intensive program about you did Philosophy, and History, and Art, and Psychology, and Sociology, and kind of the history from the pre-Greek, Ancient Greek, through modern life.발음듣기
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And the second thing is I also felt it was time to come back to the Bay Area because I had been gone for three years and now to rebuild connections in the local area.발음듣기
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And even in college, you weren't dreaming of tech entrepreneurship and you have a bit of an academic inside you.발음듣기
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Yeah. So I got to college, basically by the way you should never be too determined about what you're going to be.발음듣기
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So to think that you know everything that you're going to want to be in 10 years means you're not going to be learning between now and 10 years from now.발음듣기
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You've always got to anticipate that not only will the world change, and the environment around you change, but that you will change as well.발음듣기
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What I decided, and I'm still largely on this plan, although in a very different way than I ever imagined, was essentially be a public intellectual.발음듣기
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And what a public intellectual is is not someone who quotes fancy authors and so forth, it's someone who participates in the public discussion about who are we and who should we be as individuals and as a society.발음듣기
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People at college, they spend a lot of time talking about this, I could participate with that, and I could write for the Atlantic and the New York Review of Books and this would be a good life.발음듣기
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And then one piece of wisdom that I had, that when I look bad was like, "Oh, that was smart" but I didn't realize it was smart when I was doing it.발음듣기
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I was doing it and not realizing it was smart, was that I was like, "How certain am I about this plan?"발음듣기
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And so I was like, "If I got a Marshall Scholarship "and I went to Oxford, I could try being a graduate student.발음듣기
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And the reason for me was that the modern practice of humanities academics tends to be so narrow that it's what I think of, it's very scholarly, but it's also very scholastic.발음듣기
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And almost by definition, if you write a book that more than 50 people want to read, you're actually not being professional.발음듣기
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I appreciate scholarship, I appreciate a lot of what the folks do, but it's not what I want to do.발음듣기
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And so I spent a year scratching my head going, "I don't know what I want to do when I grow up."발음듣기
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And what I realized was, by having come to Stanford, I realized there was a thing called software entrepreneurship or creation of software, and what I said was, "If you look at public intellectuals, and you say, 'What do they do?'발음듣기
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'"And what if I could create software that would have a similar kind of public intellectual impact, maybe I should go create software."발음듣기
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No, well I had gotten a computer pretty early and I'd played with it because I was intrigued by it.발음듣기
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And my major at Stanford was a major called Symbolic Systems, which is kind of cognitive science and artificial intelligence.발음듣기
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And so I'd done some programming, but I'd never done any commercial programming, never written a program to sell, or it'd always been academic.발음듣기
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So I came back here and it was the very first time, in '93, the very first time that I hadn't planned out the next step.발음듣기
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I had an idea of a direction and an idea of a place, but I literally was like, "Okay I think I'm going to do that, but I don't know."발음듣기
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And so I moved back here, moved into my dad's apartment, I was very grateful that he would say, "Okay fine, I'll put you up."발음듣기
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And again, this was, it turns out very lucky, but I thought, "How can I find the most interesting work that I could do?"발음듣기
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Netscape had just recently started, it was only the entrepreneurial edge, the main companies.발음듣기
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This was, many people in the room won't know what these names mean, Prodigy, CompuServe, I mean AOL still rings.발음듣기
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And so I ended up getting a job at Apple Computer because they were doing this thing called eWorld.발음듣기
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And it was like, "You should do these online services and Apple Computer is a good company and you should go work there and learn interesting product development skills there."발음듣기
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And I went and did that, and a friend of mine, Jesse Ellenbogen was working there, and he's like, "Look, if you're willing to do the contract to hire thing, we have some work that we can see if it would work out and you can come work out in that."발음듣기
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And that was an intense learning experience because among other things, because I had been more directed by the ultimate outcomes, like one of the things I remember from my very first day on the job there they said, "You need to create some mock-ups "of some user experience, some images of how the user experience will work on these projects."발음듣기
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Yes, well I've always been, and I think this is true of many entrepreneurs, and I actually still by this point would never dream that the word entrepreneur applied to me, was that they have some vision for how technology or product or the way the world can be a problem solved.발음듣기
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And so, all of the social dynamics of what is called "online" or online systems" like for example, What is your identity?"발음듣기
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Now one of the things that I did that I actually think was pretty helpful was pretty soon into my time at Apple I realized that I was unlikely to be happy working on a product that it would be random luck if I found a product that someone else had constructed that I wanted to work on.발음듣기
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And it wasn't so much I had to own it as much as it was a product that I thought, "This would have the right kind of characteristics."발음듣기
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So I would literally, there was all kinds of different work at Apple and later Fujitsu where they would say, "Well we need someone to do X."발음듣기
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Because I would look at that and go, "Oh, the skills of doing that work are something I figured I wanted to pick up."발음듣기
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That's really interesting because I don't know a lot of people who do what you just described, but it sounds extremely powerful.발음듣기
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I'm guessing a lot of the things on the list are things you might have cringed at, that weren't in your comfort zone.발음듣기
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I'm like, "Okay, I'll write down product management, "but how do you break down product management?발음듣기
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'"Well, you need to have spec products, and you need to understand what the support requirements would be, "and you need to understand the engineering feasibility of it.발음듣기
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And your future collaborator, Peter Thiel, I think called this seven years or eight years ahead of its time.발음듣기
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The other thing I realized when I was doing all the skills indexing is I thought that in order to create the product that I want I would have to start a business.발음듣기
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And so, starting a business meant I would have to raise money from investors. Venture capitalists.발음듣기
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And it was like, "Well, generally speaking, the ideal target for venture capital financing is one business person, one tech person.발음듣기
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Two founders with a product that has a unique position in the market that can grow into that, that has a competitive edge, that the founders' capable of doing that.발음듣기
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I said, "Well, okay, I either have to be the tech person or the business person." and I was like, "Well I'd rather actually be the business person than the tech person.발음듣기
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Now it also happened to be a virtual world, so I was interested in that project, although I did actually tell them, which turned out to be true, is that virtual worlds were too early.발음듣기
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But because picking up all of the experience was part of getting to building the product I think I should be building, I was like, "Look, I am willing to essentially work 80 hours a week really hard on this to pick up all these skills and try as best I can to make this work.발음듣기
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What's fascinating here is you were very deliberate at an early stage in your career of saying, "I'm going to construct myself into--"발음듣기
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You decomposed what are the skills that makes someone good at this and I'm going to get them.발음듣기
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And I think the other interesting aspect, I think that there's no coincidence for what you'd do later, is when you thought about businesses it seems like you didn't say, "Where can I eek out an extra dollar or the market hasn't fully adjusted yet?"발음듣기
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You said, "What are interesting social dynamics, "problems, ways of connecting human beings?발음듣기
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'"One thing you could be doing is writing essays and trying to influence people and think about how to be different as individuals or a society.발음듣기
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But I was like, "Well, so what if you're creating software as a medium that people live in?"발음듣기
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But literally it's like the medium changes our identities, how we connect with people, who are our friends, who we play with.발음듣기
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And so given that, I wanted to play in the construction of that medium in a way that lead both the individuals and the group, the society, the community, to both be a lot better.발음듣기
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And it didn't have to be, this is one of the reasons after Socialnet I was kind of willing to join PayPal full time.발음듣기
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When the company was founded I was on the board, but when I was thinking about starting that company Peter said, "No, no, no. Come join us."발음듣기
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Everyone can essentially you decide that, "I'm going to be an artist, I'm going to sell my art.발음듣기
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Enabling anyone to be entrepreneurial and set up a business was kind of the key thing that was part of the baseline vision in PayPal.발음듣기
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Although that's now one of the reasons I'm now an investor in two different Bitcoin projects.발음듣기
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PayPal, obviously huge success and continues to be so, but there's something interesting about PayPal.발음듣기
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You all were working hard and trying to establish a new global currency, whatever it might have been.발음듣기
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Was there something about the three, there's kind of famously the PayPal mafia, it wasn't just the three of you there was a whole group of folks who graduated from PayPal and then went on to do other epic things.발음듣기
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Was there something special about the conversations you all had, the way that you all pushed each other.발음듣기
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The thing that was unique about the PayPal crew is typically when people start companies they go, "Oh, I need to get people with a lot of experience at doing just this job."발음듣기
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Like you have a lot of experience coding, or you have a lot of experience running the data center, you have a lot of experience marketing or a lot of experience selling.발음듣기
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PayPal opted for very high talent young people with the expectation that the high talent young people would learn the jobs.발음듣기
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So as opposed to hiring someone who's like, "Well, you've had a ton of experience doing this exact job, we're going to hire someone we think is a very fast learner and we're going to trust that they're going to learn the job really fast."발음듣기
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And so part of the reason why the PayPal folks all went off and were A) entrepreneurial and B) went off and did stuff is you had a whole bunch of high talent young people that had experience with entrepreneurship, experience young.발음듣기
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The PayPal story was like basically kind of let's call it four years from beginning to sales, so everyone was like, "Well I gotta go do something."발음듣기
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So everyone started running off and doing all the different things that they were interested in doing.발음듣기
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Max founded an incubator, then did Slide, and is now doing an incubator with another company, a firm now.발음듣기
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That's cause we were all like, "This is a game that we got experienced in that we like," and then, quote unquote, I don't really like the term PayPal Mafia, although it's entertaining.발음듣기
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The thing that was also very helpful then, in 2002 was when PayPal was sold to eBay, and a lot of great projects and great entrepreneurial companies get started during, actually, downturns.발음듣기
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And we were all very fortunate in that we all got free to go to our next projects during a downturn.발음듣기
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And so, that's part of the reason the PayPal Mafia all interested, although Elan went and did hard science projects.발음듣기
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That's part of the reason why it was an unusually large number of people who went and founded interesting companies from that.발음듣기
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In August of 2000, PayPal burned $12 million dollars in one month, had an exponentiating cost curve, and had no revenue.발음듣기
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So we could chart the hour in which this company, which I think at the time raised $168 million in capital, would be a smoking hole in the ground.발음듣기
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So Peter, Max, and another of the kind of junior co-founders of PayPal, Luke Nosek and I went to an offsite, in my grandparents' place in Gualala, which is in Northern California.발음듣기
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We decided that being a master merchant, which PayPal is today, which takes fees for accepting electronic payments, credit card payments in particular.발음듣기
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That was the path we were going to do and we had a lot of discussion by the way of Star Wars and the Death Star, cause we had one swoop into the trench, we had one shot at this.발음듣기
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The second day we presented the ideas that we had had to each other in terms of the kinds of things that we would also, if PayPal didn't work what else we might do.발음듣기
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And I had said a little bit about what I thought about, "Well everyone's going to have a public professional identity that will be useful to their career and their jobs."발음듣기
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And then the third day we went hiking, because we knew that was going to be our last day off for a while.발음듣기
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And then what happened is I helped sell PayPal to eBay, and then in October I was planning on taking a year off.발음듣기
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Because the metaphor I use for start-ups, in a start-up you're throwing yourself off a cliff, and you're assembling and airplane on the way down.발음듣기
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So you thermal draft by financing, you put a little bit of money you get a little bit further from the ground.발음듣기
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But until you create a plane, you actually do not have a going concern and by definition you're going to crash.발음듣기
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So that's really intense, and so after having done that, first at Socialnet, then at PayPal I was like, "I'm going to take time off."발음듣기
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And so I actually started it by going and spending two weeks with a friend of mine, Ned Hoyt, in Australia.발음듣기
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And then what I realized is that the Silicon Valley had gone crazy, that they all thought the consumer net was over.발음듣기
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That Amazon, Google, eBay, PayPal, you know, Yahoo, this was it, that's the whole consumer internet.발음듣기
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Cause one of the problems that people have is that they, generally speaking, over-imagine change in the short term, and under-imagine it in the long term.발음듣기
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And they hadn't realized that all these different ideas that people had, they're still building towards them.발음듣기
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And so I said, "Alright, I'll have to like, you know just take the two weeks as a break and not a year."발음듣기
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So I spent about eight weeks thinking about different ideas about what I could do, and ultimately LinkedIn was still the best idea of the ideas that I had.발음듣기
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So Jean-Luc Vaillant and Allen Blue and Konstantin Guericke and Eric Ly, we all kind of came together and did it.발음듣기
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And then I also decided to invest, because one of the problems with being a start-up entrepreneur is you're putting all of your eggs in this one basket.발음듣기
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I was like, "Well, I have a little bit of money, I was sure the consumer internet would do well, and so I started investing in the interesting companies in the consumer internet.발음듣기
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In the forming process, in hindsight it looks like LinkedIn is obviously going to be huge, were there moments where you were like, "What am I doing? This is not going to work."발음듣기
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One of the pieces of advice that I give entrepreneurs is 98%, like almost a hundred, almost all start-ups go through what I call a valley of the shadow moment.발음듣기
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What I told Peter Thiel is if we had stood on the roof throwing wads, like the roof here, throwing wads of hundred dollar bills over the side, we would not have spent money faster than we were spending it.발음듣기
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And we launched LinkedIn and in the first eight weeks, the number of people that were signing up for the service were about 2,000 people per week.발음듣기
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Now, roughly speaking, if you think 2,000 people per week, we probably could have gotten that many sign ups if what we had done is taken a phone book and had everyone in the company calling people saying, "Please sign up. Please sign up. Please sign up."발음듣기
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And so we knew we had to solve our growth problem, we had to get enough people inviting and getting people on LinkedIn.발음듣기
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So that's what we worked on for basically a year in order to make that work, and if that didn't work, the value of LinkedIn? Zero.발음듣기
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Then you got another problem, you say, "We got people signing up in a relevant set of numbers that was beginning to compound and grow, but okay, if we don't have a revenue stream then we also value zero," because eventually you run out of money, you can't raise anymore capital.발음듣기
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So we first launched job listings, and we knew that job listings was likely to be the thing that would be the big revenue model for LinkedIn.발음듣기
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Marketplaces are really interesting places, eBay, Airbnb, but they're very difficult to grow.발음듣기
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And we knew that getting people to understand that it could be used for finding a job or recruiting was one of the things that we wanted to do.발음듣기
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And it had exactly the impact that we, to some degree, both hoped and feared it would have, which is, "Oh, we know how to use LinkedIn now, " but not a lot of people are buying job listings.발음듣기
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And that was when we went, "Okay, now I know that I have a company that can build to something very large."발음듣기
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So more of less that was two years where you'd say, in any particular week, right now if you were to look at the data of what's happening, if you were to just say, take a look at the company as it is right now.발음듣기
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Two thirds of my friends, when I talked to them about the LinkedIn idea thought I was crazy.발음듣기
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Like, for example, when you were going around early in the Khan Academy, people were like, "Now, that's not going to work."발음듣기
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I had one moment, where I was at a dinner party, and they said, "What do you do for a living?"발음듣기
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One thing that's unusual, most consumer internet start-ups don't actually have a vision from the very beginning that they stick to, they pivot a lot.발음듣기
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LinkedIn was actually, more or less, there are things that have surprised us, some things we've learned, but more or less, we thought everyone's going to have a public, professional identity, that it is like a resume or CV, they're going to have a network of people that they trust.발음듣기
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And then there's going to be a set of applications built on that identity and network that will help them with their work.발음듣기
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'"How do I figure out which skills are the interesting skills for me to pick up if I want to get a first job out of college?"발음듣기
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All of these things we knew, from 2003, would be the kinds of things that would be coming out of it.발음듣기
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Because it's been a very consistent vision about let's build to the place where, for every individual we are the best thing to help them with their career.발음듣기
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Cause we could do big data analytics on all things and say, "Here's a list of all the human skills."발음듣기
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So there's discovery, but the direction and the true North has been unusually constant for what happens for most consumer internet companies.발음듣기
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My mission is how do I help, it's the public intellectual's mission, how do I help society be better?발음듣기
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If it's starting, and I won't start another company, but it's like LinkedIn, helping people discover what they should be when they grow up, what skills would be helpful for them getting a job.발음듣기
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And there's a bunch of stuff we do specifically also to help veterans and students and everything else within LinkedIn.발음듣기
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As part of the modern mission for good companies is to have things that you do as part of your mission that aren't just pure profit incentive.발음듣기
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It's not to say you're not always paying attention to revenue, but there are things that align with your mission that are part of the right way to help create a better society.발음듣기
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Greylock, I'm an investor, a venture capitalist, I generally invest in marketplaces and networks, so I'm an investor in Airbnb, Bitcoin companies, Zappo is one of the ones.발음듣기
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Akiva, which is a marketplace for microfinance and Do Something, which is the largest teen philanthropic community.발음듣기
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And also with Ben and Chris Yeh, this book called The Alliance, and it's how the right life strategy is to think of yourself as the entrepreneur of your own life, and what are the skills for that.발음듣기
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You is take all of the concepts that I've learned about entrepreneurship and I help other entrepreneurs and distill it into what an individual's life should be.발음듣기
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Just a final question, we always ask this at Khan Academy, but also just for some of the users of Khan Academy, what advice do you have for us as an organization and for anyone else out there.발음듣기
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How do you use technology to scale so you can possibly help tens and hundreds of millions of people take control of their own learning.발음듣기
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You help cross the digital divide in social justice because you're available to anybody who has an internet connection.발음듣기
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I'd say sustainability in terms of creation of a business model is one of the things to think about.발음듣기
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Because technology organizations, one of the things people don't understand about them is, it takes a bunch of investment every year.발음듣기
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And obviously a business model that works and aligns with the organization would be something I would think would be on the drawing board.발음듣기
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